How Leaders Think with Kenny Lange

Fedor Simic [00:00:00]:
Forecasting plays perfectly into benchmarking. You know, the biggest question and why we build actually benchmarks is to answer the major question everyone has, like, is this good performance? Obviously, like, we know that it's good because we're making money, but, like, how good is it? Where do we stand?

Kenny Lange [00:00:24]:
Welcome to the how leaders think podcast, the show that transforms you by renewing your mind and giving you new ways to think. I am your host, Kenny Lang, and with me today is the Fedor schemich. Haha. Got it. Let's record it. And that's the end of the episode. Just kidding. He is the partnership manager at Data Box, which is a data analytics and visualization company.

Kenny Lange [00:00:47]:
And now we're featuring benchmarks. Got lots of good things to say about that, and I'm sure it's going to come up. But he comes from a small town in Serbia. He started at Databox and customer support and worked his way up to partnership manager in less than two years, which is amazing. Where they are building a huge partner program, um, a new one because they have two. Boop. Right? Yeah, yeah. Got data box partner and benchmark partner.

Kenny Lange [00:01:17]:
And those are some cool things, um, that we'll talk again. We'll talk more about during the summer. He loves his tennis, and if you get a chance to him, just private message him on LinkedIn and just ask him all about tennis and his tennis club. But he loves going to the gym, which are some of his hobbies. But he also loves to shred on a snowboard in the winter season. Welcome to the show, Feder.

Fedor Simic [00:01:43]:
Thank you, Kenny. It's a pleasure to be here. Can't believe we got together.

Kenny Lange [00:01:48]:
Yeah. It's amazing that this started, um, that. That we actually were able to hit record, um, for many reasons. And if you want the behind the scenes. Yeah, it's. It's been a great conversation already. We're 40 minutes in and we're just getting started. Um, well, tell me what is on your mind today, what isn't?

Fedor Simic [00:02:09]:
There are so many things. You know, this year is really big for me. I'm getting married for the first time ever, hopefully the last time as well.

Kenny Lange [00:02:17]:
Amen.

Fedor Simic [00:02:18]:
That's already one big thing I'm thinking about. And then we're building. I wouldn't call it like our first partner program, but actually like our real first partner program here at Databox. And I've been put in one of the driving seats in it. So I've been working closely with Pete. He already did it at HubSpot, so now he's doing it at Databox, but completely different. And we're just trying to do it, accomplish it. Huge thing.

Fedor Simic [00:02:44]:
You know, I never thought I would end up here starting at customer support, then being in all those other supporting roles. And this, what I'm doing is just completely different and it scares me and it excites me every day of the week. You know, you just don't know what.

Kenny Lange [00:03:01]:
You'Re going to do if it doesn't scare you. You're not. You're not. You're not going big enough. Right. Well, real quick, for those who, I mentioned a few things about Databox, but I'm sure you have the company line. But for those who are unfamiliar with Databox, and then you also mentioned Pete, your CEO, can you just give a little bit of background, context as to what Databox is and maybe just a little bit about Pete, shout out, he's a previous guest, go check out his episode. But yeah, share a little bit about that and we'll see where this takes us.

Fedor Simic [00:03:37]:
I actually listened to that episode. It was awesome. He was really excited to talk with you.

Kenny Lange [00:03:43]:
He had the beanie on and everything.

Fedor Simic [00:03:46]:
He always has the beanie on. That's his trademark. So, yeah, Databox is an easy to use analytics platform where you can connect your data, visualize it and track it in one place, and you can also benchmark it. Benchmarks, that's a feature that we've started developing at the beginning of last year and then basically built it up mid this year. And then we kind of started partnering with other people to create benchmark groups. So it's a place where you can compare your company's performance to other companies industries completely anonymously. And it's really accurate because it pulls the data directly from the integration and it's always up to date. So, like anytime you go, you join a group for free, of course, and you will be able to see how you compare to last month's data.

Fedor Simic [00:04:43]:
So it's always going to be looking at last month's data and it's going to show you where you stand within the cohort. And there's also a timeline view, so you can look at historical performance as well. So that's how it works.

Kenny Lange [00:04:56]:
Yeah. Which can be really helpful if you're a company that, you know, maybe you struggle to figure out what your goals should be or quarterly performance goals. You know, I've recommended it to several of my clients or just friends because they say, well, we don't know, is this, you know, we think we should be aiming this high. Is that absurd or is that too low? Is that average? And these benchmark groups can really help you clear those things up so that you're far more accurate when you are setting those goals. Or you may just want to look at what are those top 25%, how are they performing? And if that's part of your mission or drive is to be a top 25% performer in your industry, well, now suddenly you can see what exactly tangibly that means, which I think is a beautiful thing that Databox is offering. One of the other things and maybe will be a right time to talk about this is also including some of the forecasting data, which is getting more and more powerful in the platform in terms of the ability to look at where actually will we end up instead of just randomly guessing where well be at the end of the year or in a couple of years, especially if were trying to hit some big benchmarks. So theres a lot of cool things that you can do now that when I first joined the partner program when I had a HubSpot agency back in 2015, 2016 just were flat out not possible. So cool stuff and they're pretty to look at.

Kenny Lange [00:06:42]:
And who doesn't like a pretty report?

Fedor Simic [00:06:45]:
Yeah, forecasting plays perfectly into benchmarking. The biggest question and why we built actually benchmarks is to answer the major question everyone has like, is this good performance? Obviously we know that it's good because we're making money, but how good is it? Where do we stand? Right? So when do you join a group? You'll immediately know that. You'll see, this is going good, this is okay, this is something that we need to work on. So if your sessions are really good, you don't need more people on your website, but maybe you need to work on your engagement rate, your conversion rate. It just points you in a direction where you should go and then you can take action on it. So you can set goals for those things you want to work on. And then you can use the forecasting feature to see where you can end up with and then what you need to do to get there. That's pretty much how you can work on and execute upon that.

Fedor Simic [00:07:40]:
So it's just going to push you in the direction and tell you where to go and then you just go right?

Kenny Lange [00:07:48]:
And I don't mean for this episode to be like one big data box advertisement and I'm not getting any compensation or anything like that. I still have to do the hard work and watch all the videos on the course, which feder reminds me of more often than he probably cares to admit, but I bring this up because it's top of mind for me and the people I'm working with. And you and I have had many conversations going back till last fall about this is the people I work with. And I think a lot of the leaders who would be listening to this would consider themselves purpose driven or mission driven, whether they're nonprofit or for profit. There are some great for profits that they want to create a great place for people to work that allows people to live the kind of lives that they want to lead. They recognize that work's just an aspect of their lives, not their whole life. And those tend to be the for profit companies that I work with. As one of my clients put it, we just want to do good work with good people.

Kenny Lange [00:09:04]:
And the thing that I've noticed about so many of these purpose driven, mission driven organizations is that a lot of times, that purpose is about where the motivations stop or where all of the excitement stops is. It doesn't always translate into performance, which you've just mentioned about tracking performance. And that's probably a keyword somewhere on the new website that got launched a few months ago, which is beautiful, by the way, but I remember, and I think you still have this course available. One of the first things Pete and the team had put together, I think even predating your arrival at data box, was that predictable performance model, which I thought was brilliant. And so a lot of my work right now is formulating, how do we turn purpose into performance? And I think you're helping a lot of people do that, because I think it's been a black box of, well, what even does matter? And how do I, you know, like you were saying, maybe we have a boatload of website visitors, but we keep working on our SEO to get found. Well, that's not driving revenue. Right. So can you talk about, you know, whether it's stuff that's out now on the website? And certainly I don't want you to preview anything you don't need to preview, but you get to be, um, on calls with Pete, who have a tremendous amount of respect for, um, not just what he's, uh, what he accomplished during his time at HubSpot, you know, starting the partner program, growing it to 100 million ARR and beyond.

Kenny Lange [00:10:54]:
Um, but he always seems to notice where the market's going and what it needs a little before the. The masses. Um, and I know that that's translating into the product development, the partnership program, things like that. Can you talk a little bit about what you and he and others are seeing and what the conversations inside of Databox are like about. What is this gap in the marketplace? What is the thinking that has trapped people in a place that warrants these new product developments that y'all are making?

Fedor Simic [00:11:31]:
Oh, that's a really tough question to answer.

Kenny Lange [00:11:35]:
That's why they pay me the medium bucks.

Fedor Simic [00:11:37]:
Yeah. And tie it to product features because I don't really work on that side that much. Like the product feature side, we're mostly working on the whole partner program and why we're doing it. The reason why we're doing it is that we mostly notice that agencies just aren't that focused on their own marketing as they are focused on helping their clients. And they're relying mostly on referrals from clients. And those are great because if you're doing a good job, you'll always get referrals. Right. And that's an awesome stream of new clients.

Fedor Simic [00:12:15]:
But it's just, it depends on so many factors, right. You don't have a hold over it. So we're just trying to empower these agencies of actually taking a handle on their own marketing without being just pitchers. Right. Because with this day and age of AI and all those features, you can automate anything. And if you do it, it's just like dehumanizes it. It doesn't have a soul kind of in it. So you're just like getting all these massive spammy emails, cold pitches on LinkedIn that are just directly pitching their services.

Fedor Simic [00:12:51]:
We're trying to help people move away from it and actually like have a meaningful conversation and actually have something to open up and have a conversation about. So that's what we're kind of helping people do with this whole partner program, and we've built it without, you know, so let me take a step back. So, like, I've realized since I'm, I've been in the partnership space for, let's say, a year now. I've realized that more and more companies are masking partnerships with sales. So if you want to become a partner, you have to buy from us, you have to spend money on us, and then you can be a partner. You get these discounts, these perks. We'll do it that way with us. There's no kind of conversations about money to become a partner, to do this, to benefit from it.

Fedor Simic [00:13:43]:
You don't have to spend a dime, you don't have to buy databox, you don't have to pay anything. You can just use this process and if you get value out of it, that's great. You might consider using our tool, but it's not at the front. It's not a prerequisite in order to do it. So I think that's how we differentiate from other partner programs.

Kenny Lange [00:14:07]:
One, I do appreciate the fact that your partner program is predicated on helping people, not trying to just sell into somebody who you want to turn around and almost be like a sales force that pays you for the pleasure of selling their product, which is what a lot of reseller, value added, reseller, affiliate, whatever you want to talk about, partner programs turn into that. Unfortunately, it becomes a lot more about the company than it does about benefiting the partner or the end user. If anybody wants to go and see more, maybe a stronger position on that, because Lord knows Pete has some pretty strong opinions on a great many things. I remember he had several posts not too long ago referencing the fact that he's seen that take off and especially in the SaaS space. Well, one of the things I want to go back to that you said was recognizing agencies, that there's the classic cobbler's kids without shoes sort of syndrome. Agencies deal with that. I think a lot of organizations deal with that. Like they don't take their own advice.

Kenny Lange [00:15:18]:
They don't, you know, they should probably utilize their own services or playbooks, and they don't. Is this benchmark partnership, is it only for agencies, digital marketing agencies, HubSpot partner solution partner agencies? Or are you all seeing that this way of looking at benchmarks and data and original research, can it apply to a broader set of organizations as a way to learn more about their customers, but also maybe create sales without being flimy?

Fedor Simic [00:16:02]:
Well, the partner program, it's designed for agencies, consultants, but we had partners that are other SAS tools, right? Like we've had, we've partnered with our direct integration partners. So we did one with Activecampaign, we did one with CallRail. So it's not exclusive to agencies or consultants, but it's more tailored towards people selling services to specific types of niches, let's call it. But the goal, the big goal overall is to just build one place that has a ton of data, not just performance data, but also insights data. So if we want to build one huge hub where companies can come to and find out how they should perform and what should they should do to get to achieve that type of performance. So that's the, the larger mission, right? So like these, all these things that we're doing, they play a role in achieving that larger goal. So like, that's our main goal. And these partners, everyone that does this with us, every company that contributes, everyone that takes a survey, they're all contributing to this one goal, which is creating this massive library of information and knowledge and data.

Fedor Simic [00:17:16]:
That's, that's the main goal.

Kenny Lange [00:17:19]:
Gotcha. Okay, so if you're, if you're selling services, probably primarily b, two b, I would imagine, then, or do you think that benchmark groups make sense if you're selling services b two c, I guess, I suppose you can sell services individually. Now, when you talked earlier about, we've got to have connectors, we've got to have, what are we plugging into so that the data is live and gets pulled at a particular interval and those sorts of things. What sorts of platforms are you pulling data from? Are they geared towards a particular industry or type of data? And can you talk a little bit about the security measures you've put in place in order to make sure that it's not being leaked or available to even databox employees?

Fedor Simic [00:18:21]:
Yeah. So in terms of integrations, we have 70 plus integrations that are available inside benchmarks. Inside databox. There are more because we can't pull in custom integrations that we built later on into benchmarks. So only, like, the most basic metrics are pulled into benchmarks. You can't create custom metrics within benchmarks. Like, only the most out of the box metrics are available for integrations. We pretty much covered all of marketing, almost like the biggest tools in marketing and sales and finance.

Fedor Simic [00:18:57]:
So we got all those spots covered and, yeah, the data. So, like, if you join a group, you don't get to see anyone else who is in the group. So, like, you don't see their names, you just see how you compare against the group and that's it. And none of us access data. We have a strict security policy. We won't leak any of the data. We do have access, but you can disable access for our technical support to check out your account if there's a problem that you report. So there's no one going to be doing that and you can turn it off so no one can log into your account as an admin view.

Kenny Lange [00:19:35]:
Gotcha.

Fedor Simic [00:19:36]:
There are steps that we took to make everything secure and it's completely anonymous, so you don't see anyone else. You just see, this is how many companies are here and this is where I am and that's it. Nothing else.

Kenny Lange [00:19:48]:
Gotcha. Talk about the profile of these companies because you mentioned you're wanting to make this sort of like global library of data. Both in terms of the data collected from these connected platforms for marketing, sales, finance, all sorts of information there. But there's another set of like the insights data. Can you talk about the difference between sort of the pooled data and then the insights data and how you're seeing that help organizations?

Fedor Simic [00:20:27]:
There's an immediate difference in the type of data. So you have on one side performance data that's pulled directly from integrations. So it, anything you have in your salesforce is being pulled as another analytics tool would pull it. So it's pulling data directly and there's no lying in the data because data doesn't lie. Everything is true with insights, those we collect through surveys. So this is user submitted information. So if you let me explain this. So if you're, let's say an e commerce business and you're doing Facebook advertising and you want to make use of what we built, you can find a group that matches what you're doing in terms of advertising, like Facebook ads, Google Ads, and then you can find a survey that talks about strategies on how to set goals in Google Ads, whatever, you can look at it like, you can see, hey, this is how I'm doing now.

Fedor Simic [00:21:26]:
And then you look at insights and see how your answers compared to what else the people have been saying. And you can see like, hey, okay, so what I'm doing is actually completely different to the majority of people that answered. So like they're doing something else, it might make sense for me to try it.

Kenny Lange [00:21:45]:
So if somebody can, can start here to at least have like an informed view of a new strategy or pivoting strategies to see, hey, what are the vast majority of people doing in terms of where are they spending? What is the mixture maybe between Facebook ads, Instagram ads and PPC or something like that. Then from there they could go, oh, okay, well, if I got $10,000 a month, here's how the top performers or the most respondents are spending it. And I could break that down so that maybe I tailor this a little bit differently and I see my success go up. And obviously you need to, I would advise anybody, learn for yourself, right. You know, anonymized and generalized data doesn't mean it works exactly that way for you. But if you don't know where to start or if what you've been trying isn't working, it can be a great fast way to pivot in my experience, because then I can go, okay, well, what are, what are the smartest people out there thinking? Because I would venture a guest, these are typically pretty sharp organizations that would even participate in a survey like this.

Fedor Simic [00:23:09]:
Like the majority of people that do answer these surveys, are agencies. So you're getting insights from other agencies that are helping clients so you can leverage that information. If you're not an agency, a typical e commerce business or any type of business can see what agencies are doing and then maybe start implementing those things on their own.

Kenny Lange [00:23:30]:
Okay. Yeah. You could sort of learn from agencies without having to hire one. Not that you shouldn't go hire my agency friends. They need your, they can help you, they'll customize something for you. But it could be a great, I think that there's a lot of steps in between doing nothing and paying the fees for a really sharp agency, like a lot of your partners are. You may need to stair step your way up to that if that's not something you've engaged in before. Now talk about some of the filters because I have made it through some of the videos in the course.

Kenny Lange [00:24:09]:
But you have a couple of different ways that you are that both databoxes set up and your training partners to think about in terms of how are we segmenting the people who get included? Because it's not just, hey, are you sort of interested in Facebook ads? Well, just join this benchmark group, right. Because if there's, if you're a two person company comparing your data against like a 2000 person company, well, it's not helpful. Right. So you're contextualizing the data. Can you talk about the filters and how you all have decided on that in order to make it as helpful as possible for the participants?

Fedor Simic [00:24:49]:
Yes, of course. So in terms of the filters, you can segment the data based on business type, industry, company size, which is the number of employees and revenue. So of course it might not be relevant for you to compare to if your business is zero to 1 million and you're comparing your data and your performance to companies that are doing over 100 million, like, that's really not relevant to you. Or you're a restaurant comparing to, I don't know, stores on Shopify, like e commerce businesses, that's also totally irrelevant for you. But you can find your own industry and niche and compare directly to people that are similar to, you know, you might not be a restaurant in New York comparing themselves to another restaurant in New York, but you're comparing yourself against other restaurants of this revenue range, of this size. So it's still really relevant data. But as we build this massive data set, that comparison will be possible. So by contributing, you're kind of paving the way towards that whole data set and towards those comparisons being feasible one day.

Kenny Lange [00:26:07]:
Right. So then that way you can, it may not be precise or like the exact match but you're at least in the ballpark and you can get a sense of what that might look like. How give us a sense of how many participants you know across the and how many studies you have going on right now.

Fedor Simic [00:26:32]:
That's a good question. I think the largest group we have has more than 9000 contributors. We have over 9000 companies in that group. I think it's our biggest, most popular integration is probably Google Linux four. Everyone has it. Even if you don't do ads you probably have GA four or I don't know why you would even be there. Probably like you probably don't even have a website or what.

Kenny Lange [00:27:01]:
Hey man, I'm anti google on a few things and I'm sure they're going to transcribe this and I'm going to get an email about it.

Fedor Simic [00:27:08]:
But we do have alternatives like Matomo in terms of insights. So we pretty much built our whole blog based on insights. We've been running surveys for the past five, six years now. We've done 1500 of those, more than that number. But it's only last year, beginning of last year when we started partnering with other people on these reports, on these researches and we've done maybe 50 with other people so far, maybe more. Probably. Probably like 60, 70 but it's somewhere in that range. Not as many but we have a bunch of experience during it.

Fedor Simic [00:27:50]:
We have a market research analyst that knows how to design those. She still hasn't designed yours, but she will one day.

Kenny Lange [00:28:01]:
One day I just throw problem questions at them. How many benchmark groups are active currently?

Fedor Simic [00:28:15]:
Several hundred. Now people are. We've first built our own groups but now people can build their own groups. You can build your own group, anyone can build their own group and put people in it. So like it's really interesting and the number of groups is just rising is every new partner we take they build their own group and so we're going to end up with thousands of groups but we're probably going to remove our groups at one point or just switch to people looking at individual metrics and building reports of that. We still haven't figured that part out but we have a lot of groups. So like you can find a group on anything, you know.

Kenny Lange [00:28:55]:
Right, gotcha. So it's not. So while they are specific, there's so many different ones that the likelihood you don't find one that somehow fits your your business or your organization type or structure or something like that is probably pretty low at this point. Is that fair to say?

Fedor Simic [00:29:15]:
Yeah, in terms of groups, I think there's still some missing, but you can just use benchmark Explorer. You can go into explorer, pick metrics that you want to view benchmarks for, and then apply all these filters that I mentioned and then gap the benchmark. And so that's a really easy way. You don't even need to connect any of your data to view it. So you can already get a glance of what the performance looks like. So you can pretty much go in, sign up for a free account, find the metrics you want to benchmark, look at the numbers, and then internally compare like off of the website, compared your numbers to those numbers. So you can do it that way, but still makes more sense to sign up and join a group and then see the charts because I think that's going to give you the percentage range of where you are. You know, here you would have to.

Kenny Lange [00:30:05]:
Be a little bit more specific or personally applicable, being that you are. Like you said, you're in a great driver's seat for building the partner program as you are having conversations with benchmark partners and talking to them about their ideas, their concepts for surveys, for what the group composition might be like. I'm thinking, what advice, what insights have you gleaned from talking to these other agencies, these other organizations that if you were to talk to a leader right now, they're not doing any benchmarking? Maybe they're tracking analytics, but it's sort of, we're in a day and age where there's data, data everywhere, but insights are hard to find. What are some insights that you've started to take away about how leaders should be thinking about their data and about benchmarking? Um, that might be helpful for them if they, if they aren't doing anything or maybe not taking it far enough.

Fedor Simic [00:31:23]:
What I've noticed is that they're just not making use of the data that they have. So they have all this data, not just from their own agency, but from their clients, and they're just not using it enough. So they're just letting it, I wouldn't say go to waste, but they're not leveraging as much as they could for their own business and for their clients. They're just not using it fully. That's what I've realized. Because they don't know how their average client performs. They have probably no idea of it, or they have been doing, they have been doing benchmarks in Google sheets. They've been wasting all this time doing it there.

Fedor Simic [00:32:05]:
But mostly it's due to awareness. When they realize what we built, they're just open up and like, wow, I didn't know this was possible. And yeah, it wasn't before we built this tool.

Kenny Lange [00:32:19]:
Or it was very, very expensive to go and get a study done that helped them see where they fit. Like a Gartner Forrester type organization that is usually reserved for your Fortune 100 Fortune 500 companies would do a big study to say where they fit in the marketplace, but that's out of reach for probably 97%. I'm just making stats up, but for a vast majority, 99 out of 100 probably can't afford a study like that.

Fedor Simic [00:32:50]:
And also, the problem with those studies, besides being very, very expensive, right, is that they're outdated, as in the moment, like, at the moment they're released. So, like, it's how it's outdated and it's most likely not relevant to businesses similar to yours. Right. Plus, to create that study, you need to complete really long survey forms. So there's also, like, that issue with the data being not that accurate. There's so many problems. It's still good information. Probably a lot of people have cited the information in their own content, but this way you can contribute to the gathering of the data.

Fedor Simic [00:33:31]:
You can use these surveys to get more data and to collect your own data as well, and then use this data in your own content, in your own marketing, in your own sales. So eventually, by doing this, if you start talking with a new prospect, you're already going to be able to tell them, like, this is how you should perform and this is what you should do to get that type of performance. So that's a major benefit. Why should I give you some great.

Kenny Lange [00:33:59]:
Questions to ask as, hey, are you seeing this particular metric perform at or above or here or better than this percentage? Because this is where most are, and now you are better positioned as a thought leader on their problem and in their space than just generalizing the best practices, which I think is something really, really powerful. But one of the things I did hear you say with regards to leaders taking a look at their data is, sounds like a lot of people are very zoomed in, in particular, maybe agencies. If you're serving multiple people and you want to know how they're all performing, whether you're a digital marketing agency or a law firm or whatever it is that you do, accounting firms, you tend to zoom in on one client and look at their performance against their goals, which is important, but you don't zoom out to see, well, how does that compare against others that are similar? And then youre like, okay, im a little bit more oriented around maybe how they should be performing, or hey, lets celebrate. Maybe ive been down in the dump thinking Im that Im just keep missing my goals. But maybe my goals were totally out of proportion to where I should be right now. Because most of the people who were putting out content are those mega large enterprise level companies who say, well, here's our percentages and here's how our profit per person or our lifetime value or whatever it is, and we all take it and go, yeah, well, that's how we should be performing. It's one of the reasons why sometimes it bothers me when we take, when I hear people cite all these leadership lessons from the enterprise, from like Steve Jobs did this, that and the other thing, and so did Elon Musk and Nutella was saying that like, okay, great, but do you understand that their context is so wildly different from the vast majority of any organization in the world that what they need to do and say and approach things isn't the same as you? And considering that, at least here in the US, you know, I think it's, I forgot percentage, but the number of businesses, the percentage of businesses that fall into the small business category, which is like less than 500 people and I believe less than 20 million in gross revenue make up, you know, anywhere from 80% to 90% plus of our businesses. Their context is so different.

Kenny Lange [00:36:44]:
It doesn't always translate and apply. And it seems like Databox is giving those organizations a chance to look at things through a more similar lens so that they can apply what they need. Now, maybe one day they need those lessons and they can do what they do, but for right now, what they need to do next is probably very different. Is that, is that out of line or do you think that that's accurate? From what you've been seeing as you've onboarded more partners and just more organizations onto the benchmark platform, I think that's really accurate.

Fedor Simic [00:37:20]:
You explained it so well, probably better than I would.

Kenny Lange [00:37:24]:
Hey, we can clip this out and put it on the website.

Fedor Simic [00:37:30]:
How much do you want for it?

Kenny Lange [00:37:32]:
What is, I just want to link back, man. Like, I see y'all's organic reach. That's all I want is a link.

Fedor Simic [00:37:40]:
You're one of those guys.

Kenny Lange [00:37:41]:
Okay, I'm one of those. You bet your sweet Bibby. Um, now, Vader, I think that, um, because of my, my fascination with performance data metrics, that was honestly one of the things that, um, was a strong suit of mine with my agency and another agency I worked at. I usually got called in to help. Let's interpret the data and make insights out of it, um, for, for clients. I, I love doing that sort of stuff. So I could probably talk for forever and chase a few rabbit trails along the way. Maybe those rabbit trails lead to your tennis club in the woods.

Kenny Lange [00:38:19]:
But I'd be curious if somebody is listening and they say, hey, maybe I'm a new vp of marketing, or maybe I'm a CEO or somebody. And I go, I do really wonder how we're doing. I look at the numbers, but I dont know what they mean in the larger context of us in the marketplace. Whats something or an action that they can take in the next 24 hours that would cost them little to no money so that they can make some progress towards really understanding what their data and performance metrics mean.

Fedor Simic [00:39:03]:
Yeah, you can just go to benchmarks dot data box.com comma, sign up for a free account and find a group that has companies that are similar to yours. Join it and that's it. It's completely free and you can do it in less than five minutes. It's really, really easy. If you are an agency or consultant and you want to see how you can use benchmarks to create your own content for your sales and your client services, you can access our free course that we published. So, okay, those are some easy steps to take.

Kenny Lange [00:39:42]:
We'll link those up. I encourage everybody. Go check that out. I mean, if you listen to this whole thing, obviously we're crazy and wild and fedor and I, we have a great time. We laugh a lot on our, uh, other calls. Um, and so I hope, I hope this was enjoyable for, for everybody. But do go check this out. It will, uh, I think make you smarter, make you better, and help you improve.

Kenny Lange [00:40:05]:
How you can help people along the way. Um, if somebody wanted to know, um, more about you and your work because you're putting out some content, sharing your learnings, uh, along the way, not just on podcasts, um, but, uh, a lot of times online, where would you send them?

Fedor Simic [00:40:25]:
To my LinkedIn profile. I think that's the easiest way to connect and have a chat.

Kenny Lange [00:40:30]:
He is a great follow. He's always sharing different things that he's coming across, things that were new, things that partners are learning that he's gleaning from conversations. So he's a great account to follow. So we'll link that up. Go follow, connect. With him, and if you have any follow on conversations, obviously you can message him. He's always happy to answer questions and help you get get started or connect you with people that can help you. If you enjoyed this conversation, if this was helpful to you.

Kenny Lange [00:41:03]:
Number one, I'm glad. I'm happy because I'm making good on what I hope to accomplish through this podcast. But please like subscribe, share rate, review, whatever you can do to get this in front of more people. Until next time, change the way you think you'll change the way that you lead. We'll see you.